Topic: True gripes about the holiday special?

OK, I searched a lot and I got a lot of information about what some members think of the Holiday special but I would like to hear some concrete reasons why people hate it so much.

Maybe it's different when you are an eight year-old boy watching it after just coming off the SW theater experience but when I watched it as a kid I thought it was great. It seems to me that the show was largely produced for children and in that respect it hit the target.   Droids, again I watched it with great enthusiasm and was always looking forward to the next episode. Ewoks, well, I didn't get into that so much., maybe if I was younger.  My brother liked it a lot but he is five years my junior.

I thought it was really cool to be able to see the crew in action on TV, and, as we all, know, it features the first appearance of BF.

So I'm interesting in hearing specifically what was so bad about the show and if there is anything about it that wasn't just terrible beyond the animated sequence.

"D'oh!"
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

I've only seen bits and pieces of it, so I can't give a full view critique, but what I saw wasn't as bad as people make it out to be.

"I swear by the soul I don't have, I am going to kill you."
―Boba Fett

3 (edited by Miba Saturday, February 7, 2009 7:24 am)

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

There's not really any way to describe just how awful it is, or what exactly is so awful about it. But I do think everyone should see it at some point. It's fascinating in the way watching a wreck is. Just when you think it's at it's worst... it gets worse, until it's over and all you can do is sit there in stunned silence.

Reality doesn't care if you believe in it.
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

Lol Miba put it perfect. I personaly hate that singing parts, and how stupid the other wookiees look. The Cartoon part is the only good part

Your god won't be there to save you, or maybe I will

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

I have only seen the animated segment and a collection of the live action sequences. It isn't a movie, and it was produced right after the first film. Often the criticism is given out of context and with more modern conventions placed on it as well. It's campy, it's hokey, but it's also fun and those that made it intended it to be so. Of course the acting is terrible, of course the set ups are quite frankly stupid. But if you were to watch it then, with the kind of television and the standards of it then, see it as the party after the movie was made. Everyone was still high on the excitment that was Star Wars and did something that would bring the cast and the crew back together.

As for the animation, I thought it was quite unique. You don't see things like that being made today, and it had a very artistic and bizarre way that it was executed. The color palatte was of Heavy Metal and The Wall, or many of the cartoon series that came out in the early 80's. But some of the animation--particularly of the characters themselves while speaking and while they interacted was more articulate and surreal than much of the conventional animation for its time. If anything, the animated segment is the most engaging of the whole series and the most adventureous.
on a whole, yes, The Holiday Special is stupid and it's laughable at how trite and ridiculous it reached the camp level, but it's also fun and entertaining and it came out when Star Wars was fun and new and everyone was happy to be apart of it. And most of all it's important to consider that it's goal to bring kids and family into that world.

It was the denial of God, the denial of man, and the destruction of the world in miniature form.

6 (edited by tachyonblade Sunday, February 8, 2009 12:16 am)

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

RShehay wrote:

As for the animation, I thought it was quite unique. You don't see things like that being made today, and it had a very artistic and bizarre way that it was executed. The color palatte was of Heavy Metal and The Wall, or many of the cartoon series that came out in the early 80's. But some of the animation--particularly of the characters themselves while speaking and while they interacted was more articulate and surreal than much of the conventional animation for its time. If anything, the animated segment is the most engaging of the whole series and the most adventureous.

I couldn't agree more. The company that produced it, Nelvana, a Canadian company, produce some incredible animated films and shorts in the 80s. As you said, the SW sequence had a Heavy Metal feel to it.
I also recomend "Rock and Rule." another Nelvana production with a fantastic soundtrack, Lou Reed, Iggy Pop, Debbie Harry.

They were a great company, Unfortunately, they only distribute these days.

"D'oh!"
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

the fact that George doesn't even want to make money off some crap he filmed (episode 1?) is amazing to me
he must actually be really embarassed

"Those with the ability to lead, have the responsibility to do so." - Lucas McCoy

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

BFFC therealmccoy wrote:

the fact that George doesn't even want to make money off some crap he filmed (episode 1?) is amazing to me
he must actually be really embarassed

WOW! You have a great point there!

But I still dig the show for my own personal reasons.

"D'oh!"
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

BFFC therealmccoy wrote:

the fact that George doesn't even want to make money off some crap he filmed (episode 1?) is amazing to me
he must actually be really embarassed

Actually that is a good point. He likes to squeeze every penny he can out of anything and everything, and the fact that he refuses to sell us this (and we would buy it... I know I would anyway...) goes to say something!

Reality doesn't care if you believe in it.
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

tachyonbladeI wrote:

I couldn't agree more. The company that produced it, Nelvana, a Canadian company, produce some incredible animated films and shorts in the 80s. As you said, the SW sequence had a Heavy Metal feel to it.
I also recomend "Rock and Rule." another Nelvana production with a fantastic soundtrack, Lou Reed, Iggy Pop, Debbie Harry.

They were a great company, Unfortunately, they only distribute these days.

I had gone to the Ottawa Animation Festival in September and Nelvana had been a part of a lot of excellent kids shows--or at least they were excellent in terms of animation and aesthetic, as far as concept I don't know. Nelvana also has a big part in the animation festivals out there--it's just nice to know that someone knows something about that, and even though they only distribute these days at least I know that the animation that comes from that is good. "Rock and Rule" is awesome, I just recently watched Watership Down after many a years and it also has that surreal, nightmareish quality like that era. If you haven't watched The original Raggedy Anne and Andy television series, see it. It also has many of the motifs in that era of animation history, but it borderlines on the heavily drug induced state of mind. I'm thinking of the "Greedy" episode explicitly and puts Jabba the Hutt to shame. Don Bluth's work is very similar to what happened to Nelvana. Anastasia was sort of the turning point of his films like The Secret of Nihm, All Dogs Go to Heaven, etc. And then Titan AE came out and it was almost unrecognizable as to where he had taken his animation and I didn't like it at all when comparing his work on a whole.

It was the denial of God, the denial of man, and the destruction of the world in miniature form.

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

RShehay wrote:

Don Bluth's work is very similar to what happened to Nelvana. Anastasia was sort of the turning point of his films like The Secret of Nihm, All Dogs Go to Heaven, etc. And then Titan AE came out and it was almost unrecognizable as to where he had taken his animation and I didn't like it at all when comparing his work on a whole.

Yeah, I'm with you 100% about Don Bluth. I think The Secret of Nihm totally rocked. And, yeah, what's up with Titan AE? that was terrible.

I think animation is too easy to produce these days, technically, and it has produced an atmosphere where untalented, uninteresting people are able to get some $ together and produce crap. Now the studios have too many choices, and as most producers are all about the $ they pick the stuff they think will generate funds not the stuff that has artistic merit.

"D'oh!"
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

Eh, I think Bluth went downhill as early as All Dogs Go to Heaven. Maybe its just me, but I really didn't like that movie at all. Maybe he was already using up his good ideas (don't see how that could be though, considering Land Before Time came out the year before and totrally rocked)? I can't be alone in my sentiment, the movie was only a partial sucess. Beats the hell out of Rock a Doodle and A Troll in Central Park though....

But we are totally off topic. The cartoon in the special is the most I've watched and the most I will ever watch. Considering it's supposed to be the best part of the special....then the actual special itself must be some bloody, horrible, train wreck. Funny how you guys are praising the animation, because I thought it was awful! Even for the late 70's. and I know the company can do better then that because they did the first two CareBear movies, as well as the second and third seasons of the TV show.

Half Dragon, half human, 100% Fett!

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

only good part is the Boba cartoon. not just cuz it's Boba, but because he has three fingers on each hand, a completely different armor set, and it's canon. and that kashyyyk came out how george imagined it, which is the same as episode 3, which i liked kashyyyk.

plus george lucas stated that he would burn every copy in the world if he could. luckily, he was one of three directors of the SWHS. and he was one of six writers of the screenplay. i think that it may have gone better if it was all his.

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

I think that it was the very fact that the animation was soooo weird and not exactly good which was why I like it so much. There is a lot of it where there are some obvious bad skating and glitchy loops. I think it was how the characters moved--so unnatural that I liked it so much. But yeah, The Holiday Special itself was so bad that it arced around and became awesome. I'd watch it for a good laugh

It was the denial of God, the denial of man, and the destruction of the world in miniature form.

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

Well, the story goes is that Lucas wrote a very basic script, then went off to concentrate on Empire. Then they brought in more writers and changed it to the point where it was unrecognisable from the first draft. I belive Lucas didn't even realise what had happened (supposibly the most time he had spent working on with the HS was the Fett short) until it was screened to him a few weeks before it was to air. And by then it was too late to pull it from the scheduel.

Half Dragon, half human, 100% Fett!

Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

CeciliaCrimsondragonFett wrote:

Well, the story goes is that Lucas wrote a very basic script, then went off to concentrate on Empire. Then they brought in more writers and changed it to the point where it was unrecognisable from the first draft. I belive Lucas didn't even realise what had happened (supposibly the most time he had spent working on with the HS was the Fett short) until it was screened to him a few weeks before it was to air. And by then it was too late to pull it from the scheduel.

Well in that case I can see why he would hate it and try to "destroy every copy he finds". Poor guy.

Reality doesn't care if you believe in it.
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

So far I have not been convinced, does anyone have any more specific complaints to justify all the hate?

"D'oh!"
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Re: True gripes about the holiday special?

The whole animations seems a cheap rip off of the system. It'll have a new code for the holiday, so gotta wait for that.